a few things i've been unable to grasp.

[Up Da Crick]

GSD/ 1 3/4yrs/ Female
1. In ball throw, i cant get her to retrive full distance with 2 balls in play. her focus is always to the next ball. introducing treats (fresh liver chunks) doesnt help either.
what kind of things can i do

2. On recall she runs past, does not touch me without me calling her again. and comes to lay in a nervous prey like. tail is stiff, sometimes in between or close to leg.

3. While attracting her with food have her follow me like a heel. she tends to cross over infront loses interest within a few paces. pace is important too. the slower i walk the sooner she is lookin away for anything and then refocusing on the treat. in a jog pace she veers infront or creates distance but stays with in motion.

4. if i pet her or anyone else, she expects more of it and it engerizes her and she gets whiney and anxious. it takes a while to just lay down, which can only be sparked again by the slightest.


Are their links or audio i can refer to for more on these issues?


I just fear that i wont be able to accomplish some of my goals.
would professional help through an NDTrainer be considered? i live in canada but i've contemplated seeing someone about her.

There is a trainer recommended around here
Two Brown Dogs Canine Consultants

This has me stressed.

[Sang]

Just off to bed but checking in. I'll reply tomorrow, but just wanted to let you know that it's all solvable, and that it really essentially comes down to increasing her attraction to you, as she has a lot of resistance to you right now. Once you can do that, all those other issues will start to resolve themselves. I'll elaborate tomorrow. Stay tuned.

[Lee Charles Kelley]

Originally Posted by Up Da Crick

GSD/ 1 3/4yrs/ Female
I just fear that i wont be able to accomplish some of my goals.
would professional help through an NDTrainer be considered? i live in canada but i've contemplated seeing someone about her.
This has me stressed.

Hi Up Da Crick,

Are you doing the pushing exercise?

If so, have you tried starting a play session by getting down on your hands and knees and acting like a dog when initiating play? Do a play growl, a couple of play bows, move toward her, then move back, all the kinds of moves that dogs make in order to interest another dog in wrestling or playing "chase me."

If your dog is still reluctant to play with you, just roll over on your back and cry out, "Oh no! You got me! You got me! You're the alpha dog!" I call this "the reverse alpha roll." Lee Charles Kelley: How to Do an Alpha Roll

Sometimes I'll start a dog like yours by hand feeding her, but not using the pushing exercise, simply by lying on my back, placing some tasty tidbits on my tummy, and letting her eat that way while I stroke or scratch the spot where her ribcage meets the abdomen.

Once she's having fun eating off my tummy, I'll teach her to jump up on command. (Lee Charles Kelley: How to Cure Jumping Up)

Then, once she's into jumping up on me, I'll set up a situation where I invite her up to grab a toy, but before she can make contact, I run away, teasing her with the toy, and encouraging her to chase me. I'll zig-zag, stop and start, change directions, fall down, jump back up, etc., teasing her with the toy the whole time. (This should take no more than 10 - 15 secs.) Then I'll let her grab the toy, and play a quick round of tug.

Don't be stressed! There's lots of things you can do!

LCK

[Sang]

Lee's got some great suggestions, as always.

I actually wouldn't worry too much about playing fetch with her. That's kind of like "mousing", and what you really want is for her to be "moosing". I think Neil's written an article about it, but I can't seem to find it right now. Fetch tug is awesome, but just fetching with a ball doesn't offer enough resistance value to ground her energy. If you want a better description of what I mean by this, I can explain, but it will be a whole nother post. But this leads me to Lee's question about if you've been pushing with her.

If you can get your dog to push with all her force into you for her meals, that's actually going to be a lot more satisfying to her than just playing fetch, because it requires her to put a LOT more emotional investment into the activity, as she needs to overcome resistance to get what she wants. Playing fetch with balls is actually just frittering away energy that you want her to give to you. Some dogs are cool with playing fetch, and it's enough, but if you have a higher drive dog then you're going to need to do things with her that require her to commit more energy into the "game". And right now playing fetch is probably actually more frustrating for her than anything, since it's not giving her enough resistance to overcome to bring her energy to ground.

If you are pushing with her, then she's definitely not giving you all her energy, as the resistance she has to you when you call her reflects that. She still isn't attracted enough to you to overcome the resistance she has towards you. So you really need to focus on gaining access to the deeper levels of energy she's holding back, so she gives that to you when pushing. Once she's pushing with everything she has, then you can evolve that into tug and bitework, and then ultimately playing push of war.

As for the petting. Don't do it. Think of it like this. Right now her entire existence is built on top of a shaky emotional foundation, and any input/attention you give her only reinforces that unstable foundation. So when you pet her or give her attention, even attention you think is "positive", in her world it's actually negative because it's just being piled on top of an emotional makeup that consists of nervousness and anxiety. You've seen that clearly when you pet her and she gets whiney and anxious. The only interactions you should be having with her right now should be ones where you're helping bring her energy to ground, which is through activities like pushing, playing tug, doing settle work on a box, etc....those are the times when you can massage her and talk sweetie pie to her. If you do the sweetie pie stuff and affection stuff at any other time, like when you're hanging out around the house, you're only adding stress to her system that needs to come out, and she'll start "leaking" that stress, which again, is reflected in her whining and anxiousness, and her inability to settle down.

The biggest thing is to just relax, and understand that your dog is just telling you that you need to settle down and not be anxious. Typically the dog is just reflecting something going on in your life, so you have to ask yourself if there is something in your own life that's causing you extra stress or anxiety. Ultimately though, don't worry about it all so much. Trust me, once you stop worrying about her so much, you'll start seeing improvements without doing anything at all.

Hope that helps.

So what part of Canada do you live in?

[Up Da Crick]

Thanks for the replies, i'm runnin out the door to work now and will fill in the blanks later

to Lee,
I've just got into the play antics in the last few weeks roughly.. yes i get low into a squat and stare down then i dodge my body left 2 right then either i charge her and follow for a few seconds till she blazes ahead, then i turn and run away whistling if she has not focused on me, or call her name as shes in chase.
i'll let her catch up and run around and we rotate prey/pred mode while moving a few times. then we get back to the stand off and after that 1st charge i can usually get her to come with a call and a backpeddle almost instantly.

the one thing that had me worried about her temperment is when we're at a stand still and i just call and she runs up, she runs past thats understandable, but when i call her and in the last 10-20ft coming up to me im low and pat the ground or a forward hand and say down, down quiet not yelling tone, lots of "good girl down". she does it real well, but she goes into a very prey tale close to body not curled up into her hind but sometimes tight to the leg, and lots of eye contact from her side.

I get the impression shes coming down in a nervous like fasion. normally i dont have food on my side so i cant quell it with that, and usually i have to search for a ball from that position so once i leave it changes the dynamic and shes out of that mood.

But i definitely feel that resistance still due to the position she takes. but shes very quick to come into my space and stay as long as i guide her with that down stuff i mentioned earlier.

i will come back to this thread. (my interenet cut out when i wrote the thread i wasnt aware it actually posted. yay)

Thanks Sang
Thanks Lee

[Sang]

So don’t worry about asking her to “down” right now, in any way shape or form. From your description of her body language, it sounds like she was trained to suppress her drive when asked to do obedience type work. So when you ask her to down, even though you’re doing it in a quiet, “positive” way, it’s still causing her physical memories of previous training to kick in, which is shutting her down. Asking her to down right now is training, and you don’t want training. You want to attract her energy at its highest level, and asking her to do obedience stuff is only adding to the resistance she already has towards you. So when she starts to show any signs of shutting down like that, you’ll know that you’re triggering past memories, and you’ll need to back off and not ask her for those behaviors yet.

For now, just focus on attracting her energy, and the things that Lee suggested are terrific for doing that. If you do want to work at all on her down/settle, do it on a box or raised platform while you’re feeding her. Just keep feeding her on the box, and then slowly use your food hand to guide her into a down, and once she’s in a down position, just keep feeding her so she starts to learn to let go of that old memory of being trained to suppress her energy when in the down position. If you need more clarification, go ahead and ask.

[Up Da Crick]

yah sang energy changes.. ah. thankyou sir. something about yur post struck me.

i was gonna write some long post but i got stuff to do now.
cheers sir

South western manitoba is where i live