Two Dogs

[El Fug]

I have two dogs. I have been doing the pushing exercise (and tugging) with each of them. I mentioned in my little intro spiel that I have some misgivings about some of the theoretical underpinnings of Natural Dog Training as espoused by Kevin Behan. One thing that I cannot argue with, however, is that both my dogs LOVE to do these basic exercises (well, still working on tugging with V).

The problem I'm having is figuring out how best to institute these exercises whilst juggling the two dogs. What I've typically done thus far is take them both out in the yard, tie one of them up, and work with the other one. The tied-up one never likes this, and lets me know in various not-so-subtle ways. When V is tied up, he simply never stops barking, and I invariably stop working with TC momentarily to put V inside, where he continues to bark incessantly as he knows that I'm outside having a blast with TC.

I worry that I'm actually causing more anxiety by doing this than I'm alleviating (by performing the exercises). I should say here that I don't have endless amounts of time to devote to the dogs on a day-to-day basis, though I do have enough to work with them in the fashion I've described above.

If anyone has ANY suggestions or insights, I'd LOVE to hear from you. I'm really enjoying using the NDT methods. My caveats aside, I feel like I've really stumbled upon a very powerful and worthwhile methodology. Thanks in advance!

[neilsattin]

It is possible (both in your description and in your worry) that you are causing stress, though it's hard to know where you end up in the whole equation.

If possible, I'd probably just take one at a time and work out of sight of the other. Go on a short walk around the block, perhaps, and work as you go. Hopefully that keeps dog #2 from getting all worked up in the first place.

If you had a partner, you could each be working with a dog at a time, and you could use the "stress" of the situation to get more of a push/tug out of your dogs at the same time.

Or you could try to set up two trolleys - far enough apart so that your dogs can't reach each other, but close enough so that you can stand in the center and work with them simultaneously.

You could potentially have one dog on a trolley and another on a short leash, and work with them at the same time too - but I'd only consider doing that once you have MANY hours of pushing under your belt.

Your best bet is to work with them separately to keep the issue of "potential stress" out of the picture. However, please share if you have more thoughts/ideas/concerns - of course!

[El Fug]

Lately, rather than tying the "nonworking" dog in the yard, I've been putting him in the bedroom in the house. When V is the sequestered one, we can pretty well hear his barking the entire time that TC and I are workng together.

To clarify a bit, I'm worried that the sequestered dog is the one that's being stressed due to the separation, not the dog that I'm working with. The dogs definitely get stressed (well, certainly V does) when one of them is left at home while the other goes on an outing. They also much prefer not being left at home at all actually, even when together, as is the norm.

I'll put it out here --- V is a handful. I love him to death, but he's got some real behavioral "issues" and frankly I'm not very optimistic that anything is really going to help. This is probably not the best attitude, but I want to be honest about where I'm at. I lose my temper sometimes and end up yelling at him, this particularly due to his incessant barking. I sort of feel like my girlfriend and I probably did everything wrong when he was a puppy and there's no real going back. Add in some inbred (ahem, purebred) genetic nervousness, and it just seems insurmountable.

But with TC I feel as if I've got something of a wonder dog. Anyway, I'll continue to push and tug with them until I buy the DVD, after which point I'm sure I'll be doing a bunch more pushing and tugging.

Thank you again!

[kubo]

It takes a lot of patience to work with a "challenging" dog. I only have one but let me tell you, if you keep working with V, he WILL be the perfect dog you always wanted, no matter how bad his breeding, puppyhood, etc. was. And, don't blame yourself. I'm sure you did the best you could and to the best of your knowledge when he was a puppy.
Celebrate all the small steps, give yourself and your dog the time you both need, and don't worry about other people's progress. Every dog and every person is different.
I have been working with my Shiba ever since I got him and we still have a long way to go. It's a journey, enjoy it!
Envision your perfect dog and believe in him and yourself!

[Chris]

I fully agree with Kubo it's so much work dealing with a 'challenging' dog and it's also extra difficult dealing with one when you also have a good one by your side but man it's a great journey once you find the right way.

It is hard not to go down the track of why aren't you like the other one?why don't you just do what the other one does? It's taken me a while to get my head around the big differences in my two dogs but with time you do get there. I'm now at the point I can do heaps with them together, when we play Ty does 80% of the tugging and fetching because Zeke is happy to chew on his toy and trot around watching Ty but when I do tug and fetch with Zeke, Ty has learnt to have some patience and wait his turn, he used to bark and push between us but that's stopped now.

Ty is also a barker, something I'd never had to deal with before and as I have the dogs at work it does cause some problems but now that I accept Ty needs to bark and I also ask him to bark when we're playing his barking is so much less these days.

So keep up the good work the improves sometimes happen so slowly that it takes a while before you realize "Hey he hasn't done that 'behavior' for weeks now"

[neilsattin]

You know, at one point I was going to do an article on the "perfect dog" - which would be all about how the ideal dog behaves, and conclude with a picture of a stuffed toy dog.

My approach to opportunity dogs (which is how I try to reframe the "problem dog") is to figure out what they're communicating to me. What issues, perhaps within me (or in the dynamic between me and my significant other) are being given a voice?

I wouldn't worry too much about the stress caused by separating them to work with them independently. Especially if that time allows you to more effectively DEAL with the stress. Do keep us posted though!

You will find, I think, that as you progress with your training with V he will learn how to settle when you're away.

Also bear in mind that it's normal in a home with multiple dogs for the two dogs to push each other to opposite ends of the behavior spectrum. It's differentiation in action. So your "wonder dog" is also an influence in creating the "bad dog". They will always be different, but you should be able to bring them more into balance as their behavior more reliably revolves around you, and their stress finds a reliable outlet in what you do together.