Pushing Benefit

[Chris]

Originally Posted by Sang

I can totally relate to your dog's drive to chase squirrels, so I'll share another story. My hound/pointer mix was always a squirrel chaser. We used to live in a neighborhood called Oak Park because of all the Oak trees. Needles to say, LOTS of squirrels. And when she was a puppy, she had free reign of the backyard to chase them. You can imagine how much of a charge the squirrels put in her, as she'd always chase them and never get to have that energy resolved.

We now live on a hill covered with trees, and no fence. Not as many squirrels as in Oak Park, but squirrels appear nonetheless. After doing the pushing with her consistently for a while, the coolest thing happened. One day I was out there with her and a squirrel ran by. Now, she wasn't far from me and the squirrel ran by on the hill, so it didn't cross directly in front of her path, but in the past just the sound of something running would have made her take chase. So what happened this time? She looked up, saw the squirrel, then immediately looked at me. As soon as she looked at me I got excited and took off running. She chased after me instead of the squirrel, and then we did some pushing and she was satisfied. She circled around me, we played some more, and then we went inside. Now, some people might tell me something along the lines of, "Yeah, but I bet your dog doesn't have as much energy as mine". Well, this is a dog that used to need an hour of frisbee play and intense exercise EVERY day. Which I made sure she got, otherwise she wouldn't be able to get to sleep at night. But she was NEVER satisfied. Always excited around the house, pacing around. She could never settle down. Once I started doing NDT with her and the other dogs, she and the other 2 are SO chilled out and relaxed in the house. And they all sleep like babies. Amazing.

Hi Sang thanks so much for sharing this story. My Ty sounds a lot like your hound/pointer mix, here in NZ we don't have squirrels but hundreds of rabbits. Thanks to NDT Ty is now slowly redirecting to me when he sees a rabbit run off and it's the coolest feeling when he does. I also used to do hours of physical ball throwing and frisbee playing to tire him out but nothing worked . Now with some tug and pushing he sleeps like a baby most of the day.

[Sang]

Originally Posted by donnieo

Sang;

Your story about your squirrel-chasing dog definitely gives me hope. Jinxsie is mad about the squirrels, and I have yet to get a really good redirection in when she sees them. I always try to redirect her before she gets too excited but if one bolts past her she goes nuts right away. I've been trying to run the other direction and get her to give me a "hup", but so far it hasn't really worked. I think I just need to keep pushing with her and maybe fast her for a day before I try the conflict training again. I have been able to get her to push when there are other dogs around or cats, but the squirrels seem to be the biggest challenge.

Yep, just keep pushing and then increasing the stimulation around her. Remember, the squirrels are just a trigger. The squirrels in and of themselves aren't what she's after. She's just attracted to them as a means to download her energy. But if you can increase her attraction to you to a high enough level, with the pushing and the bitework/tug, she won't be drawn to the squirrels anymore. But definitely work up gradually. There's no rush. Building the foundation between you and her is the most important thing. Once you have that, everything else will start falling into place.

Another thing you can try though, if she's close enough to you when she gets fixated on the squirrels and your attempts to rechannel her aren't working, is to push her around a bit. Sweep her feet with your hands or with a toy. Push her hind end around a bit with your hand. Anything to upset her balance a little. This will help break her focus on the squirrels, and give you an opportunity to channel that squirrel energy to you. It's more something you can do when you didn't catch her in time before she gets fixated.

Just always keep in mind this process can take time. Some dogs have big shifts really fast, while others take quite a while. Every dog is different in that regard. But trust me, you'll start to see changes.

[BrownieNJoyce]

Thanks for all the posts prior to this one. Great to hear about re-directing and read about someone's experience of being more attractive than the squirrel. I am trying not to fear the spring when they will be darting about in full force since I don't know how long it will take us to get to a stage where I can re-direct even when the distraction is a squirrel. Right now I have the luxury of walking my dog in early a.m. and evening when it's cold and dark and there are no signs of squirrels. And my husband takes him out in the day on a rail bed where he skis and the dog trots along at the same pace so doesn't stop too often.

I am hopeful, however, as we are making some progress with the pushing. I'm getting a better feel for positioning my body and we've been at it for a couple weeks now. We do twice a day 3-4 days a week and once a day on the other days since I get home late and my husband hasn't had as much time to learn. So he just feeds him out of his hand and moves backward a little big without trying to do the pushing. I figure this is a lot better than just putting the bowl down for him. This way they are practicing the earliest stage and can move from there when my husband is available to learn more.

Tug is still in the future for us. Can't wait til we can play together!

Anyone have comments about having partners or other adults involved with their dog who are not practicing NDT full out but have responsibilities with dog walking? I almost don't want anyone else to walk my dog but we have to have a friend do it midday sometimes if we are both working all day.

[donnieo]

Anyone have comments about having partners or other adults involved with their dog who are not practicing NDT full out but have responsibilities with dog walking? I almost don't want anyone else to walk my dog but we have to have a friend do it midday sometimes if we are both working all day.

This has been a bit of a sticking point with my partner and I. We both have dogs and very different viewpoints in regards to their training. She has no interest in NDT which is frustrating because while I've seen very profound changes in my relationship with my dog (particularly in her recall), her experience with Jinxsie normally involves Jinxsie taking off on her to chase squirrels or bark at strangers. Although she won't let me practice NDT with her dog, I do play a lot of tug with him (and let him win) and even from this I find that he is more relaxed around me than he is around her. I've stepped back from trying to convince her to try NDT and hope that once Jinxsie is giving me 100% of her energy, she will come around.

That said, I highly suggest that you teach your friend how to walk your dog with Lee's "leash walking 101" so that at the very least your dog is learning not to pull while he's out with your friend.

[BrownieNJoyce]

Brownie and I are coming along! He is starting to push fairly hard now! Just yesterday there was a shift and this morning he gave me even more energy. This is such a huge difference from me having to stay still so he wouldn't back away while I just fed him from my hand. He's never had a problem with being touched while eating so I didn't have to work up to that so I was able to massage his neck from the beginning. No massaging now! We're in action. He's really attending to the "Ready?" and moves right in when I say his name. I think my body mechanics and hand positions have improved but I know I still can adjust even more as I get more practice. And I'm really excited for the both of us. Thanks to everyone for their posts and for being there to read about our progress.

[Chris]

Originally Posted by dogismycopilot

We're in action. He's really attending to the "Ready?" and moves right in when I say his name. I think my body mechanics and hand positions have improved but I know I still can adjust even more as I get more practice. And I'm really excited for the both of us. Thanks to everyone for their posts and for being there to read about our progress.

That's great news, it's so exciting when it all starts to click. I remember the first time Ty 'got it' I ended up knocked back against the door with the amount of energy and push he gave me after that I learnt to brace my feet ready for him but it's a great feeling when they really push into you.

[neilsattin]

Hi Joyce,

Glad to hear that things are coming along - and what great input from everyone here on the thread.

re: other people with walking responsibilities - you can always tell your friend that you've found this really cool new training technique (in case they're interested to learn more). I wouldn't "worry" about it at all, though, if someone is handling your dog who has no knowledge - it won't set back your dog at all. As long as they don't do anything detrimental! (no alpha rolls or pops on the collar, please)

In the past, when I've had a dog-sitter (something I prefer to kennels), I usually just ensure that they keep my dog on-leash, steer clear of other dogs (just in case), and otherwise enjoy the walk and the sniffing around. And don't worry about pushing/etc., unless they're interested. Occasionally they are...

[BrownieNJoyce]

This morning I took Brownie's food with us on our walk and pushing helped us moved past unsupervised dogs. We've really improved enough that when a couple dogs approached us on some previous walks (even though all I had was treats and he didn't care that much about the), he didn't get aggressive as he had in the past. Helped that I was relaxed as I was hopeful that I might see a change. Squirrels and cats are another level but I can start to imagine it now.

[Sang]

Originally Posted by BrownieNJoyce

We've really improved enough that when a couple dogs approached us on some previous walks (even though all I had was treats and he didn't care that much about the), he didn't get aggressive as he had in the past.

Nice! Just goes to show, it's not the "value" of the food itself, but the energetic resolution that pushing provides that the dog is really after.